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October 28, 2003

THE MEMORY HOLE REVISITED....Yesterday I posted about the White House blocking access to parts of their site from search engines like Google. Was it an effort to prevent Google from caching pages that they might later want to change behind our backs?

Probably not. Ryan at the Dead Parrot Society says that 2600 magazine looked into this — via the sneaky ruse of actually talking to someone at the White House — and received an explanation that seems pretty innocent. I guess there might be more to this, but unless someone with more technical mojo than me can poke a hole in their explanation I'd judge it to be pretty reasonable too. Looks like they're probably off the hook for this one.

Posted by Kevin Drum at October 28, 2003 04:49 PM | TrackBack


Comments

Darn. No spies in that scandal so I would have had an easier time forming an opinion.

Posted by: Justene at October 28, 2003 04:56 PM | PERMALINK

Thanks for clearing that up. I really appreciate it when us lefties set an example by proactively correcting our mistakes :)

Posted by: paul at October 28, 2003 05:11 PM | PERMALINK

I'm willing to admit it's a mistake, but I'm not yet persuaded that it is. The explanation from the White house doesn't sound that convincing:

The attempt, Mr. Orr said, was that when people search, they should not get multiple copies of the same information.


Two questions: why is it worth some Whitehouse communications employee's time/salary to make sure all of us out in the ether don't get multiple copies of the same information?
And isn't it a piece of information in and of itself, perhaps worth discovering via a Google search, that the same press release appears in different sections of the website?

I could be convinced that this is all innocent, but if my first reaction is suspicion, can you blame me?

Posted by: cerebrocrat at October 28, 2003 05:25 PM | PERMALINK

Does Google only supress redundant results if they're completely identical? Or does it do that for very similar results, too?

Posted by: jon at October 28, 2003 05:48 PM | PERMALINK

Yeah, it's possible there's more to this, but at this point I doubt it.

As for why, it was probably a brainstorm by one of the techies. We anal retentive types do that kind of thing, you know.

Posted by: Kevin Drum at October 28, 2003 06:23 PM | PERMALINK

Geez - I wish we us you lefties would learn to use the nominative case correctly. Do "we" correct a mistake or do "us" correct a mistake? Do "I" poke a hole or does "me" poke a hole?

Sorry - twice within 6 inches just got to me.

Otherwise, we us you do great - hint, not us.

Posted by: oldenglishtutor at October 28, 2003 06:45 PM | PERMALINK

As a web techie I can tell you that it's not unusual to block robots from directories containing content. In the good ole days a call for a page returned just that: a single page/single file. With today's more modern web publishing technologies pages are constructed on the fly from several files (header, footer, different content windows, modules, stylesheets, etc.) and content residing not in a file but in a database. If a robot were allowed to search the directories of "parts" then Google searches would lead to incomplete and unformatted pages being returned. Not a good user experience. It would be like going to Avis and being given just a fender instead of the whole car. The key to determining whether the WH is trying to hide information lies in whether or not there are links to pages that include these content parts about Iraq on the pages that are allowed to be searched by the spider. If the WH only makes these document links available via their own site's search engine and not based on clickable links, then more than likely the motivation is opacity and obfuscation not worry about maintaining a good user experience. Robots don't do search forms! They follow clickable links.

Posted by: fastback at October 28, 2003 07:16 PM | PERMALINK

It's not difficult to make web pages that don't get indexed by search engines. It's just a single line of code to add to the pages. I don't know why getting duplicate pages in search results is a big deal to them, though.

Posted by: Buck J at October 28, 2003 07:19 PM | PERMALINK

Actually, oldenglishtutor, the "me" ought to be a nominative "I" because he's looking for "someone with more technical mojo than I [have]", not because "I can poke a hole in their explanation".


And by the way, are you a tutor of Old English/Anglo-Saxon, or an old tutor of Modern English?

Posted by: John at October 28, 2003 07:32 PM | PERMALINK

tutor:

"us XXX" is acceptable in informal usage these days.

'us' in "us lefties" is used an adjective, not pronoun in that post.

Tell it to "us lefties" or "we lefties"? I understand the case agreement involved but to me maintaining the complexity isn't desirable for informal speech.

Posted by: Troy at October 28, 2003 07:38 PM | PERMALINK

I wonder if those duplicate pages (with the different template) are generated on the fly from one source document, or if they're static.

If they're static, then there'd be a risk that if they changed one copy of a page, they'd forget to change the other. So blocking Google would prevent the unmodified copy from turning up easily, and possibly causing a faux pas.

If, on the other hand, a change in one place (such as a central content database) would be reflected in both versions of the page, then I'd say it probably is innocuous.

Posted by: Jon H at October 28, 2003 08:35 PM | PERMALINK

I had the same question as Jon. I am guessing they are all pulled from the same database, at least that would make more sense, from a technical perspective. If that is the case then the explanation from the Whitehouse makes a lot of sense.

Posted by: allan at October 28, 2003 09:18 PM | PERMALINK

I have only one questions: What reason do you have for believing any information coming out of this White House?

MKK

Posted by: Mary Kay at October 28, 2003 11:31 PM | PERMALINK

I tend to believe the WH explanation. Keep in mind, it's entirely voluntary for robots to obey the robots.txt protocol. I am certain that crawlers have already been set up to do so. So if the Roveites really had malicious intent, they're doing a bad job of implementing it. What they would really want to do is configure the web server to ignore requests from Googlebots.

Besides, it's not really the style of the administration. I would expect them to send a court order to Google, declaring that caching of government pages to be a violation of the DMCA.

Posted by: Dave at October 29, 2003 05:41 AM | PERMALINK

thanks for the correction. We'll see if everyone else who creamed their jeans over this one has the integrity to post their own corrections.

Posted by: A-ro at October 29, 2003 06:53 AM | PERMALINK

Atrios, as of this moment, has not published a retraction.

Posted by: Registered Independent Joel at October 29, 2003 07:46 AM | PERMALINK

WTF? Clicking on the "explanation" link does nothing but close my IE web browser. Never seen a link that did that before.

Posted by: Simon at October 29, 2003 08:22 AM | PERMALINK

Simon--
That's probably just some sort of deadly clash between your browser and the blog in question. Brad DeLong's site seems to be doing that to me these days. (Note: I am not a techie, so don't believe me.)

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