October 25, 2003
SPONDYLOLYSIS....Is AP serious? In an article about the
presidential candidates and their service records in Vietnam, reporter
Nedra Pickler reports that Howard Dean was rejected because of a medical condition:
an interview with the AP, Dean said he had known since he was in high
school that he had an unfused vertebra, a condition called
Dean tried to spell the condition during the interview, but got it
wrong after three tries, even though he is a medical doctor and worked
as an internist before entering politics. He laughed over his difficulty
and defended himself by saying he is not a bone specialist.
Someone actually wrote a paragraph criticizing Dean because he can't
spell spondylolysis "even though he is a medical doctor"? Am I the only
one who thinks someone is trying a little too hard to look tough and
Posted by Kevin Drum at October 25, 2003 04:39 PM
I'm an M.D., and I had to think long and hard about it to spell it in my mind. Some medical words are hard to spell!
Spondylolysis (did I spell that right?) generally is not a serious
problem (though it might restrict bloodflow to the brain and cause one's
thinking to be confused, which is why it's found more often in liberals
-- har har, that's just turning around an old Democrat joke, har har).
It is serious enough to keep one out of the military.
Ha ha! Can George Bush spell "Canada", even though he is president of the US?
I expect this to be a headline if Dean wins the nomination, a la Gore
and Love Canal. This is exactly the kind of excrement that the
national press would be delighted to see become the basis on which
Americans decide the 2004 presidential election. They'll consider it an
accomplishment, a feather in their caps, as they did with Gore and
"invented the Internet." They'll say, "George Bush is a man of
deeply-held Christian faith, while Howard Dean can't even spell
I expect all doctors to know everything about all areas of medicine,
even if they're a specialist. Or if they have a doctorate in history or
You know, there's anti-intellictualism, and then there's ridiculously-stupidism.
From what I understand of the condition, Dean wasn't aware of it
until that point. It's not really a big deal, unless you're planning on a
lot of stress on the back (like, say, hiking with full packs for
several miles a day, and maybe crawling through the mud at odd
As people have noted, you can lead a physically active life
(including skiing and sports) with it, and not really have a problem.
But the military (rightly so) doesn't want people who have it, unless
they're desperate for troops. And even in Vietnam, they weren't
desperate enough for troops to have to call up people with that class of
I agree it silly. But then I thought it was silly when so many people gave Dan Quayle a hard time about misspelling potato.
Potato . . . spondylolysis . . .
Yeah, that's roughly equivalent in degree of difficulty.
At least Dean knew he was misspelling it, as opposed to Quayle, but that's quibbling.
As someone who worked in orthopedic rehab, there are several
conditions (some are the same but can be spelled differently I
believe)that have similar spellings. Some that I am aware of are,
spondylolysis, spondylosis, spondylysis, spondylolisthesis,and
spondylolythesis. I remember having to always look up the diagnosis
based on the spelling to make sure I had it correct and that I was
completely certain of the problem.
Anyway...Lest we forget..."Is our children learning?" Funny how
basic(elementary) verb agreement and usage of proper grammar in
Miserable Failure's verbal language is so easily forgiven. Such
different standards indeed!
But then I thought it was silly when so many people gave Dan Quayle a hard time about misspelling potato.
Maybe so, but really, there's just no comparison. It's possible for a
reasonable person to think that this "spondylolysis" story is a piss
poor attempt at mudslinging even if they laughed like hell at Quayle's
For one thing, remember that Quayle was doing a photo op at an
elementary school. (My memory may be a little hazy since this was eleven
years ago.) A little kid had just written the word "potato" correctly
on the blackboard. The vice president of the United States then jumps up
and "corrects" the kid by putting an "e" on the end to make it spell
Now that's not only politically embarrassing, it's also really funny!
Plus it has the human interest angle. So it got a lot of press that it
Now we have this. "So, how do you spell "spondylolysis", Doctor?" It isn't politically embarrassing for Dean, it isn't even funny, and it makes you wonder WTF is up with the AP!
Silly, sure. But Quayle did ostentatiously "correct" a primary
school student's spelling at a photo op with camera's rolling; a kid who
afterwards remarked that he knew Quayle had it wrong, but (unlike the
VP) was too polite to contradict him in front of a crowd. Big Bad Dan
earned his ridicule, fair and square.
I was thinking of spondylosis, but apparently spondylolysis, which
I'd never heard of, is a different condition. Google has lots of hits
for both. I agree that not being able to spell potato and not being
able to spell spondylolysis (which I would bet that well over 99% of the
population has never heard of) aren't quite in the same league.
Surely Dean should just have told the interviewer 'You're the journalist, you spell it.'
Here is a link to the whole "potatoe" story:
http://www.capitalcentury.com/1992.html . The article relates that
William Figueroa, the kid who spelled the word right until Quayle
"corrected" him, went on to drop out of high school, knock up his
girlfriend, and work at a low-paying job at an auto showroom.
I've read that one of the physical requirements was, specifically,
the ability to carry a 75-pound load on your back for a specified period
of time or distance, something which Dean was unable to do.
In addition, Slate's profile on Dean had this excerpt from MTP to explain his deferment:
Dean told Russert, "I was given an examination. I had a previous
back problem, which is evidently congenital, which prevented me from
doing any sustained running, a problem that I've had since then...
But I have been able to exercise and have a vigorous athletic life
except for some things. One of those is long-distance running, which is
how the problem came to my attention in the first place. I noticed the
pain when I was in high school running track. … After the physical, I
received a 1-Y deferment, [which] means you can only be called in times
of national emergency. I didn't have anything to do with choosing any
draft deferment. … The United States government said this is your
classification. I'm not responsible for that."
In the May 25, 2003, Washington Post, Dean's campaign manager, Joe
Trippi, said, "[Dean's] view is, 'Look, I went in, got a physical and
was rejected, and then I went on with my life.' "
I like how the AP story lets Bush completely off the hook, and sums
up his less-than-completely-accounted-for National Guard tenure thusly:
"President Bush was in the National Guard during the war and did not see combat."
End of story. You'd think there might be a mention of the controversy
surrounding Bush's Guard days... the fact that he jumped dozens of
spots on the waiting list to get his post, his unaccounted-for time,
failure report for duty, grounding, possible failure of flight
tests...After all, they mention specifically the other candidates draft
numbers and everything. But, that might make the wrong people
uncomfortable, better to make fun of Doctor Dean.
This is worthy of a news report because......?
I'd love to bash Dean as much as the next guy, but, really, "spondylolysis"??? It ain't potato.
Nevertheless, devin is certain right when he writes "Surely Dean
should just have told the interviewer 'You're the journalist, you spell
it.'" But I assume that Dean was trying to show off his medical
knowledge and got caught. And that's the real story. (Hey, I know that
all politicans like to show off part of their bios. But it makes them
look dumb if they screw up some detail of what they are trying to push.
I would put this in the same category as if Bush got some detail about
West Texas wrong, or if Kerry got some detail about Vietnam wrong.)
The Yankees Lost!The Yankees Lost!The Yankees Lost!The Yankees
Lost!The Yankees Lost!The Yankees Lost!The Yankees Lost!The Yankees
Some team from Florida or Georgia, I think.
Relax. No one is giving Dean a hard time, not the way I read this
story. I'm amazed that we're even discussing it. He's not being
Is that why you guys can't write anything??? You know, that's readable...you know, legible?
It's like that joke about the doctor who was having a hard time
keeping up with his bills after first hanging out the ole shingle after
He decided to take up kidnapping to raise some funds but had to give it up...as NOBODY could read the ransom notes...Ha ha ha.
Go Dean....BTW, I was helpping with the voter registration last
weekend and I'm always suprised by how many people DON"T vote. And yet
it is one of the most powerful tools in our democracy...I don't know why
so many people take this basic right so frivolously???
er I was helping that is..
I'm an artist, and I can't spell "Michaelangelo."
OH yes and also this part...
vote, and yet NOT vote. and yet... wasn't that good--can't
spell, can't proof read either but I do like Howard Dean HOWEVER
liberals do like folks that are very articulate and Dean does seem to
have a problem in this area.
I hope this isn't a persistent problem for Dean... Dean needs a
lawyer VP to help with argument since he might BE president? But in a
Senate that is controled by Republicans and same with the house...
This is why Clinton did so well - he understood the fine art of negotiation and getting to YES...
Doctors don't know shit about that.
Upon re-reading I realize that this an X-rated post. Parental discretion is advised.
All those different spondo words made me laugh. Lordy, are they a
pain in the patootie. (sometimes literally) Nice to hear there's
someone else who has to check them all.
But if you think doctors have trouble, you should listen to the patients! Bless them, how hard they
try! And it's no use asking them to spell it.
Let's see what I can remember.
Pee-new-money is easy.
The "smilin' mighty jesus" can send you right to Jesus, if you're unlucky.
Everyone wants to avoid bleeding so much you have clogs.
Fireballs in the eucharist can cause women to have clogs, especially at the change of lights.
Don't ever break the female bone in your leg. It requires imperative therapy (that much is true), and can take months to heal!
Remember those heman (female?!) clogs that woman can have? They come through the virginny.
(For some reason I always get the urge to hum "Shenadoah" when I hear
this fairly common mispronunciation. Makes no sense. Should be "Carry
Me Back to Old Virginny")
And, in case you think women have it rough, let's not forget the trouble that dratted prostrate glad can cause.
Is your blood sugar high? Bet you've got dohn-beat-us. Or maybe the sugar beets-us?
If you're African-American, I really hope you didn't inherit
sick-as-hell anemia. This mispronunciation sticks around because it's
all too true.
Do you have Mediterranian ancestry? Well, then along with sick-as-hell anemia, you could inherit tassel-anemia.
If you develop high-tension (sounds like a circus act), you better take your pills so you don't get a parallel stroke.
Speaking of pills. Are you allergic to penichillun? Gives you a red
rush? (Wait 'til John Ashcroft hears that!) Or maybe it's worse, and
you get a ana-prophylactic reaction?
If you are allergic to penichillun, your doctor might describe
tricyclelines for you instead. Pedal right over to your local drug
dealer and pick them up.
Then there's good old Eureka-mycin.
And people think medicine is a serious business...
There's a whole profession called "medical secretary" which make
their livings spelling this kind of word. A complete Stedman's medical
terminology library would run you something like $1000.
Clinton could get to Yes by pretty much butchering what plans he really wanted to input.
Of course, that's the essence of negotiation, but it's nothing
special...and wait, how the hell did we even get to discussing that?
Howie Dean can't spell spondylolwhothejesusthoughtthiswasagoodword and
now the Republicans are going to keep him from getting his plans passed?
Is that sarcasm,
Howie Dean can't spell spondylolwhothejesusthoughtthiswasagoodword
and now the Republicans are going to keep him from getting his plans
No, they'll use their majority in Congress to keep him from getting
his plans (such as they are at this stage) from getting passed.
Seriously, we're making a mountain out of a molehill. Dean himself
seemed to not have an issue with it, and the reporter probably included
it to seem humorous or as a 'human interest' part of an other wise
As far as Dean getting a medical deferment, yeah, I buy his story,
it's a legit reason... but he then proceeds to go skiing? I mean,
Clinton at least avoided (and eventually submitted to and was not chosen
by) the draft for personal moral convictions. If you can ski, I think
you should be able to be an intel officer or a military doctor or
Not a disqualifier for me (even though Dean's not on the top of my list), but it just kinda baffles and confuses me.
BTW, was Dean involved in the anti-Vietnam movement like Clinton or
Kerry, or was he just kind of aloof until he decided to enter politics?
spondylolysis, or one of those related terms came up in a playground
spelling challenge around 8th grade. "Hey, spell 'spondyloysis'" Of
course, none of us knew that there were related-terms. Spell
'spondylolysis' and you knew it all.
Maybe the reporter suffers from spelling bee trauma.
I mean, Clinton at least avoided (and eventually submitted to and was not chosen by) the draft for personal moral convictions.
Well, the thing is that Dean didn't avoid the draft. He went to his
physical and they rejected him. What did you want him to do? Protest and
insist on getting drafted?
I presume that the spelling attempts were verbal, spelling bee style.
Had he had a chance to write it, I bet he wouldn't have any problems.
That is, if the reporter could pronounce "spondylolysis" correctly -- is it spon-di-LO-li-sis or spon-do-lo-LIE-sis?
Jack The Kangaroo: Do you know that Dean's brother disappeared/got
chopped while on a boat trip down a southeast Asian river during the
war? I can't recall what river (I think it was Cambodian), but in all
likliehood his sibling was working for the CIA. Either that, or he was a
young man completely devoid of common sense.
As a medical editor who's worked on a number of orthopaedics books,
I'm convinced that quite a few orthopods would have spelled it wrong
too, if the manuscripts they submit are any indication--sometimes I
wonder if these people went into medicine because they couldn't pass
some kind of basic writing requirement. There are indeed several spondy-
conditions. My job doesn't require that I know exactly what each one
is, but that they are spelled correctly in books(what medical
dictionaries are for)and that's why I'm an editor and not a doctor...
However, as a Dean supporter, I didn't think it was an attack
exactly, more like showing Dean with a sense of humor about himself.
After all it didn't say he was *angry* at not being able to spell the
I picture Drudge trying to come up with his head-line this morning.
"Liberal Dem Dean misspells spondy..umm..spondyliosis...umm...oh fuck it"
Um, isn't that the reason that word processing programs have spell checkers?
Just out of curiosity, if Dean had been really gung-ho about serving in Vietnam, would this condition have disqualified him?
Suppose the draft board physical discovered a not-terribly-serious
condition, like this one, which technically made him medically unfit.
(I think we'd all agree that if the physical discovered a serious
condition, like a heart problem, any draftee would be disqualified.)
Could Dean have appealed to a three-physician medical board, or
something? If he'd written his congressman or the Pentagon and said
that he was determined to serve, could he have gotten in? Could he have
served in a non-infantry capacity?
It does seem as though the Vietnam draft was a little generous with
medical deferments. If you look at recruiting stuff from WWII -- I was
reading an old Collier's magazine the other day, and it had an ad
recruiting naval aviators; to qualify for flight school, you basically
had to have good vision and a pulse -- the standards were far, far more
I know plenty of people who escaped the draft for "medical" reasons
who are totally healthy. Those "trick knees" and "cartiledge disorders"
never seemed to bother them again after the selective service physical.
It seemed like the draft boards were basically doing them a favor by
disqualifying them. The question is, if the favor was offered to you,
did you have to accept it?
As far as Dean getting a medical deferment, yeah, I buy his story, it's a legit reason... but he then proceeds to go skiing?
I'm sorry, this doesn't make any sense. The military rejects him,
and then Dean is supposed to...what? Give up every physical activity?
They didn't give him a disabled parking permit, for crying out loud, or
impose some sort of limitations on his civilian activities.
I mean, geez, Rush Limbaugh had a cyst on his ass that got him out of Vietnam, but would you complain that he "then proceeds to sit down"?
In their efforts to avoid an all expenses paid trip to southeast
asia, many young men went to extravagent lengths to "beat" the draft
physical and get the treasured medical exemption. What made this so
challenging was the fact that the exam was so prefunctory that even a
corpse had a small, but still positive, chance of passing.
All this hooey over spelling. I never understood it during over Dan The Potatoe and i still dont understand it here.
In Bush's case we can probably make a case that his thinking is
impaired and that the misspelling is definitely a symptom. In Dean's
case we can't lodge that argument because we cannot plausably accuse him
All those of you who would destroy someone based on his or her
spelling - get a grip - especially when people like Bush can surely
spell taxes but sure as hell doesn't seem to know basic economic
assumptions concerning them.
Dean says he was relieved that he couldn't be drafted--he opposed the
war and didn't want to go. I find this refreshingly honest--YMMV.
My cousin, son of a waitress and a gas station attendant, was
rejected for flat feet at about the same time Dean was rejected for his
back problem. He actually WANTED to get into the army but they wouldn't
take him. That was in New York and Dean is from New York, too. I
guess they were able to meet their quota easy enough in NY to not have
to take people with even minor health issues.
Here's what the dictionary has to say about a related word: http://www.m-w.com/cgi-bin/dictionary?va=spondylitis
Apparently "spondylos" means vertebra and the suffix "-lysis" is
quite common. Those are two things that Dean should have known and been
able to put together and spelled correctly.
Maybe you guys should reconsider your Dean support and put your votes behind The Right Reverend.
I think some are missing the point about this article. It's not what
is getting said about it now, or how Dean feels about it now, or what
we think about it now.
It's what happens 6 months down the line when Sean Hannity pulls it
out of his a** and says Dean is a doctor but can't spell a medical term,
how can he be president? All context is loss, all memory of the event
for that matter is lost, and people believe it as some conservative
spin point. A la Al Gore, as another poster so rightly pointed out at
Did I saw Sean Hannity? Sorry, I meant the RNC.
Well, at least I didn't criticize anybody's spelling. That should be "did I SAY."
I'm hardly a Republican or Dan Quayle fan, but the 'potato' story is just so blown up.
He's told he's going to judge a spelling bee, given a list of words
and told to read them off and correct the children's spelling. The list
has 'potato' incorrectly as 'potatoe.' He doesn't notice it.
He expected the list to be correct, and his mind was probably on
other things. Who among us hasn't looked at a word that looked 'funny',
and yet it was spelled correctly?
But enough people really wanted to label Quayle as 'stupid', and the meme took hold, which really is stupid.
For a word like "potato"? Come off it. It was dumb.
The reason the Quayle "story" had legs is because the man was vapid
and the potato(e) incident was decent anecdotal evidence that everybody
Dean, however, is not a dullard; that should be pretty clear to
everyone. You can agree or disagree with Dean on a number of issues but
trying to make hay of his spelling brands the provocateur as a
I found it revealing he couldn't spell the word. Not only is he a
doctor and should know root words and suffixes and prefixes, but more
importantly, he has had this condition for about 40 years. He should
know exactly what his condition is. And if he does, I don't see any
problem in spelling it. Just break up the word. I don't think he has
spent much time over the last 40 years thinking about it. That's why he
couldn't spell it.
I write for a living and I still have to look words up for spelling.
This idiot reporter making an issue out of this is pure stupidity.
By the way, Dan Quayle was a dumb-ass, I think my 4 year old niece
could spell potato correctly. He deserved the ridicule he got.
for the full scoop on spondy:
even the spinal specialists i've worked with call it "spondy" ...
On a tour of Latin America, Quayle said, in front of Congresswoman
Barbara Jordan and two ABC reporters that he had wished he "took more
Latin so she could talk to these people".
When Jordan addressed the Congress, right after their plane landed, she opened her speech with "pray for the president."
Quayle IS stupid.
Nedra, how do you spell "shut the fuck up"?
My baby brother was rejected for the draft because he had a heart
murmur that he was unaware of before his physical. He had been on the
wrestling, tennis and swim teams during high school (and continues to
this day running, playing basketball, swimming and playing tennis). He
was relieved because he didn't have to move to Canada after all. He was
able to continue his work on his doctorate in physics using his
The whole family was relieved, even my career army dad!
By the way, I liberally used my Webster's dictionary to write the above as this was not a post I wanted to screw up.
Wish a reporter would poll Dean's patients for their opinion. I
worry about his temper but if he gets rated highly by patients, he's
aces with me.
For some reason, all I can think of is a classic Looney Tune, with
Sylvester and some big ol' dumb cat who keeps calling him George. "My
name isn't George! It's Sylvester!" "But I can't say 'Sylvester', George!"
I just went to the spondy web site provided by spk (thank you spk).
My daughter was diagnosed with spondylolysis. (I didn't remember the
word the doctor used but you do remember I said my baby brother was
classified 4F). She ended up having surgery when she was 19 to fuse her
spine and have steel rods inserted on each side of he spine. She's now
40, can't touch her toes but plays softball.
The military is and was not interested in providing free medical care to people (including Dean) with preexising conditions.
I can't understand how some of you - especially you Dean supporters -
are failing to see that this article is, in fact, an attack on your
man. The reporter lets Bush off the hook with a single sentence:
"President Bush was in the National Guard during the war and did not see combat."
Then goes on to grill Dean for seven paragraphs, ending with this?
"After graduation, Dean spent some time in Colorado, where he skied despite his back condition..."
Don't you get it? Bush served in the National Guard, Dean skipped out on the draft in order to go skiing...
By the way, this reporter, Nedra Pickler, is becoming well known to some
of us. Here's a link to another "fair and balanced" story she did, this
time about the recent democratic debate...
And here is a link to Eschaton, where there are other stories and posts about Pickler...
Ha ha! Can George Bush spell "Canada", even though he is president of the US?
can BUSH™ spell Uzbekistan, even though they are a member of The Coalition of The Billing?
The military is not interested in drafting someone who could more
easily be hurt. It costs them to provide medical care. Especially
something that could develop into a serious spinal or major neurological
problem. And he was 1Y, which means had he been around for WWll he
would have been drafted. But cannon fodder in the 60s and 70s was
plentiful, as opposed to 1945.
I have a son - swims, runs, does everything he should be able to do -
but he cannot straighten one arm due to arthritis; can't carry heavy
stuff with it, can't hold a rifle right. He's 4F, but healthy.
My wife has worked teaching mobility to bilnd people for over 25
years. When she first started using a word processor with a spell-check
function (about 12 years ago), she was aghast to find that she had been
misspelling "opthalmologist" her whole life!
As a dyslexic and habitual misspeller, I have to object to using a
person's spelling ability as a measure of intelligence. It's stupid and
people with dyslexia and some other learning disabilities often simply
cannot learn to spell despite being otherwise intelligent people. For
dyslexics, it's especially difficult to learn to spell when even the
simplest words look profoundly wrong even when spelled correctly. Even
Dan Quayle deserves some slack for the "Potatoe" gaffe. The Latin gaffe
on the other hand was just idiotic.
They invented word processors with spell-check so that we don't have to worry about spelling in typed documents.
By the way, the inability to spell didn't stop me from getting a Ph.D.
I was in a small room with Quayle a few years ago as a few people
were questioning him in a sort of friendly fashion. It was blindingly
obvious to everyone that the man is just shit-stupid. He oozes stupid.
But he also oozes pure, raw ambition in a way I'd never seen before. It
just comes off him in waves like an emanation, and it's mixed with or
fueled by the vanity he also oozes. An amazing experience to see.
It was like the poet in the movie Candy, whose hair always blows in the breeze no matter where he is.
I've never been in a similar situation with Bush. I'm sure it would
be pretty much the same, except that Bush is probably less interested in
pleasing people than Quayle is.
"Well, the thing is that Dean didn't avoid the draft. He went to his
physical and they rejected him. What did you want him to do? Protest and
insist on getting drafted?"
Pleez ! I broke my back in 1957 (three level compression fracture)
and passed an Air Force physical in 1959. Dean went down there with a
letter and his x-rays knowing exactly what would happen. What he did
wasn't illegal, just don't make up all these excuses for him.
Quayle got sandbagged by a staff member who actually misspelled
potato on a flash card. He probably knew how to spell it if he had been
writing a sentence with the word in it.
Bush Sr. got unfairly trashed when he made a comment about a
supermarket scanner. The incident never happened but it fit the story
the reporter (I think the same one that Bush Jr made the famous remark
about) wanted to tell. Bush Sr. didn't know about the common person's
I don't care if Dean can spell spondylolysis, or spondylolisthesis.
He probably doesn't know the difference but no internist does anyway.
Few orthopods could recognize atrial fibrillation on an EKG. No big
ot, but others started the Quayle thread..
Did anyone ever notice how when the press was sniffing around a story
that would hurt Bush the senior, Dan Quayle would play court jester,
and the press would get so caught up in the song and dance, and the cute
little bells on his feet, that Bush got away.
Potatoe, if I recall corresponded awefully well with news cycles where some part or an other of iran contra was breaking.
You do not get the degrees that Dan Quayle holds by being stupid, you
get "gentelman's 'c'" from an institution that you only were admitted
to inthe first place cause your daddy went there.
Just my thoughts on the Whole Dan Quayle episode.
It wasn't that Quale mis-spelled potato. He tried to correct a child
who had actually spelled it correctly. That he did this during a
photo-op, clearly brings ridicule to bear. There is no comparison.
Dr. Dean was classified 1Y by his draft board.
1Y means you are eligible to serve only in times of national emergency.
We now have a national emergency, and he is reporting for duty.
No one will ever read this, but potato is singular, potatoes is
plural. The word Dean tried to spell has several other similar medical
terms that spell close to the same. Both Quale and Dean have good
excuses. Goes to show just how childish most people who are political
are. We could all have educational discussions over issues, not this
kind of minor stuff.
it strikes me that if you have a condition then you would probably
know how to spell it. and another thing, if dean wanted to serve he
could have, but everybody at the time was looking for something to keep
them out of a body bag. dean and bush are both guilty of wanting to STAY
ALIVE. seesh, its not like one or the other was molesting kids or
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